[Beowulf] Electricity cost: a critical survival issue of our ICT infrastructures.

Vincent Diepeveen diep at xs4all.nl
Thu Apr 11 11:09:18 PDT 2013

At european energy market one has to PAY if you deliver windmill or  
solar panel energy at hours the market doesn't need the energy.

So a huge energy producer exploiting such windmill parks effectively  
loses more money than he makes. Same with solar plants -
yet there is very few of those and the ones there are very tiny.

This is a realistic worldview on solar and windmill energy of course  
and should be also translated into not subsidizing it except for  

Right now it's moving money directly from EU to China which produces  
windmills and solar panels, of course at a price no one here can  
compete with.

Gas always has been huge in Netherlands as energy source (we also  
export gas) yet oil hardly gets used to produce electricity.
World wide usage of coals only is increasing, especially in 3d world  
nations. The nations using lots of coals only use more and more of  
the stuff.

I'm a bit amazed though USA is using that much coals and gas as when  
compared to the nuclear production of it.
Of course assuming the table is correct that Jim quoted, as there is  
no market where that much desinformation gets spreaded as in the  
energy world,
as there is always billions at stake and politicians simply don't  
want to bring the bad news to their voters that there is as of yet no  
good way to produce
electricity without some sort of major disadvantage, be it CO2 output  
or killing all fish and eco life of a river with a hydro plant or the  
risk of a melt down of a
  nuclear central. They just are not prepared to tell the truth and  
governments then mess up statistics not seldom.

On Apr 11, 2013, at 12:59 PM, Eugen Leitl wrote:

> On Wed, Apr 10, 2013 at 09:40:38PM +0000, Lux, Jim (337C) wrote:
>> In the US, electricity comes mostly from coal and natural gas,  
>> with the latter rapidly replacing the former.  France is somewhat  
>> unusual in having significant nuclear generation, but in the US,  
>> nuclear has been roughly constant at about 20%.
> It doesn't have to be nuclear, coal or gas
> http://www.renewableenergyworld.com/rea/news/article/2012/10/german- 
> coal-fired-generation-of-electricity-falls-while-renewable- 
> generation-rises
>> In PetaWattHr
>> Coal	1.517
>> Gas	1.231	 (natural)
>> Nuc	0.769
>> Hydro	0.277
>> Renew	0.219	(wind, tidal, solar)
>> Oil	0.013
>> Other	0.012	(no idea what this is, biomass?)
>> Gas	0.011	(other, blast furnace gas, e.g.)
>> Coke	0.010 	 (from oil)
>> Over the last few years, Coal is decreasing by about 200 TeraWh/ 
>> yr, Nat gas increasing by about the same. Oil is decreasing by  
>> about 3-4 TWh/yr, renewable is increasing about 20-25 TWh/yr.
>> http://www.eia.gov/electricity/monthly/epm_table_grapher.cfm? 
>> t=epmt_1_1
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