<html xmlns:v="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:vml" xmlns:o="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:office" xmlns:w="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:word" xmlns:m="http://schemas.microsoft.com/office/2004/12/omml" xmlns="http://www.w3.org/TR/REC-html40">
<head>
<meta http-equiv="Content-Type" content="text/html; charset=utf-8">
<meta name="Generator" content="Microsoft Word 15 (filtered medium)">
<style><!--
/* Font Definitions */
@font-face
{font-family:Wingdings;
panose-1:5 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0;}
@font-face
{font-family:"Cambria Math";
panose-1:2 4 5 3 5 4 6 3 2 4;}
@font-face
{font-family:Calibri;
panose-1:2 15 5 2 2 2 4 3 2 4;}
@font-face
{font-family:Verdana;
panose-1:2 11 6 4 3 5 4 4 2 4;}
/* Style Definitions */
p.MsoNormal, li.MsoNormal, div.MsoNormal
{margin:0in;
margin-bottom:.0001pt;
font-size:12.0pt;
font-family:"Times New Roman",serif;}
a:link, span.MsoHyperlink
{mso-style-priority:99;
color:blue;
text-decoration:underline;}
a:visited, span.MsoHyperlinkFollowed
{mso-style-priority:99;
color:purple;
text-decoration:underline;}
p.MsoListParagraph, li.MsoListParagraph, div.MsoListParagraph
{mso-style-priority:34;
margin-top:0in;
margin-right:0in;
margin-bottom:0in;
margin-left:.5in;
margin-bottom:.0001pt;
font-size:12.0pt;
font-family:"Times New Roman",serif;}
span.EmailStyle17
{mso-style-type:personal-reply;
font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;
color:#1F497D;}
.MsoChpDefault
{mso-style-type:export-only;
font-size:10.0pt;}
@page WordSection1
{size:8.5in 11.0in;
margin:1.0in 1.0in 1.0in 1.0in;}
div.WordSection1
{page:WordSection1;}
/* List Definitions */
@list l0
{mso-list-id:212037889;
mso-list-type:hybrid;
mso-list-template-ids:-1188121882 688656654 67698691 67698693 67698689 67698691 67698693 67698689 67698691 67698693;}
@list l0:level1
{mso-level-start-at:0;
mso-level-number-format:bullet;
mso-level-text:-;
mso-level-tab-stop:none;
mso-level-number-position:left;
text-indent:-.25in;
font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;
mso-fareast-font-family:Calibri;
mso-bidi-font-family:Arial;}
@list l0:level2
{mso-level-number-format:bullet;
mso-level-text:o;
mso-level-tab-stop:none;
mso-level-number-position:left;
text-indent:-.25in;
font-family:"Courier New";}
@list l0:level3
{mso-level-number-format:bullet;
mso-level-text:;
mso-level-tab-stop:none;
mso-level-number-position:left;
text-indent:-.25in;
font-family:Wingdings;}
@list l0:level4
{mso-level-number-format:bullet;
mso-level-text:;
mso-level-tab-stop:none;
mso-level-number-position:left;
text-indent:-.25in;
font-family:Symbol;}
@list l0:level5
{mso-level-number-format:bullet;
mso-level-text:o;
mso-level-tab-stop:none;
mso-level-number-position:left;
text-indent:-.25in;
font-family:"Courier New";}
@list l0:level6
{mso-level-number-format:bullet;
mso-level-text:;
mso-level-tab-stop:none;
mso-level-number-position:left;
text-indent:-.25in;
font-family:Wingdings;}
@list l0:level7
{mso-level-number-format:bullet;
mso-level-text:;
mso-level-tab-stop:none;
mso-level-number-position:left;
text-indent:-.25in;
font-family:Symbol;}
@list l0:level8
{mso-level-number-format:bullet;
mso-level-text:o;
mso-level-tab-stop:none;
mso-level-number-position:left;
text-indent:-.25in;
font-family:"Courier New";}
@list l0:level9
{mso-level-number-format:bullet;
mso-level-text:;
mso-level-tab-stop:none;
mso-level-number-position:left;
text-indent:-.25in;
font-family:Wingdings;}
ol
{margin-bottom:0in;}
ul
{margin-bottom:0in;}
--></style><!--[if gte mso 9]><xml>
<o:shapedefaults v:ext="edit" spidmax="1026" />
</xml><![endif]--><!--[if gte mso 9]><xml>
<o:shapelayout v:ext="edit">
<o:idmap v:ext="edit" data="1" />
</o:shapelayout></xml><![endif]-->
</head>
<body lang="EN-US" link="blue" vlink="purple">
<div class="WordSection1">
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:#1F497D">Let me try to help:<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoListParagraph" style="text-indent:-.25in;mso-list:l0 level1 lfo1"><![if !supportLists]><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:#1F497D"><span style="mso-list:Ignore">-<span style="font:7.0pt "Times New Roman"">
</span></span></span><![endif]><span dir="LTR"></span><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:#1F497D">OpenStack is supported natively on InfiniBand already, therefore there is no need to go to Ethernet for that<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoListParagraph" style="text-indent:-.25in;mso-list:l0 level1 lfo1"><![if !supportLists]><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:#1F497D"><span style="mso-list:Ignore">-<span style="font:7.0pt "Times New Roman"">
</span></span></span><![endif]><span dir="LTR"></span><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:#1F497D">File system wise, you can have IB file system, and connect directly to IB system.<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoListParagraph" style="text-indent:-.25in;mso-list:l0 level1 lfo1"><![if !supportLists]><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:#1F497D"><span style="mso-list:Ignore">-<span style="font:7.0pt "Times New Roman"">
</span></span></span><![endif]><span dir="LTR"></span><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:#1F497D">Depends on the distance, you can run 2Km IB between switches, or use Mellanox MetroX for connecting over 40Km. VicinityIO have
system that go over thousands of miles…<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoListParagraph" style="text-indent:-.25in;mso-list:l0 level1 lfo1"><![if !supportLists]><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:#1F497D"><span style="mso-list:Ignore">-<span style="font:7.0pt "Times New Roman"">
</span></span></span><![endif]><span dir="LTR"></span><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:#1F497D">IB advantages are with much lower latency (switches alone are 3X lower latency), cost effectiveness (for the same speed, IB switches
are more cost effective than Ethernet) and the In-Network Computing engines (MPI reduction operations, Tag Matching run on the network)<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:#1F497D"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:#1F497D">If you need help, feel free to contact directly.
<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:#1F497D"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:#1F497D">Regards,
<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:#1F497D">Gilad Shainer<o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:#1F497D"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
<div>
<div style="border:none;border-top:solid #E1E1E1 1.0pt;padding:3.0pt 0in 0in 0in">
<p class="MsoNormal"><b><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif">From:</span></b><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif"> Beowulf [mailto:beowulf-bounces@beowulf.org]
<b>On Behalf Of </b>John Hearns<br>
<b>Sent:</b> Thursday, November 26, 2020 3:42 AM<br>
<b>To:</b> Jörg Saßmannshausen <sassy-work@sassy.formativ.net>; Beowulf Mailing List <beowulf@beowulf.org><br>
<b>Subject:</b> Re: [Beowulf] RoCE vs. InfiniBand<o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
</div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><o:p> </o:p></p>
<table class="MsoNormalTable" border="1" cellpadding="0" style="background:#FFEB9C">
<tbody>
<tr>
<td style="padding:.75pt .75pt .75pt .75pt">
<p class="MsoNormal"><b><span style="font-size:7.5pt;font-family:"Verdana",sans-serif;color:black">External email: Use caution opening links or attachments</span></b><span style="font-size:7.5pt;font-family:"Verdana",sans-serif;color:black">
</span><o:p></o:p></p>
</td>
</tr>
</tbody>
</table>
<p class="MsoNormal"><o:p> </o:p></p>
<div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal">Jorg, I think I might know where the Lustre storage is ! <o:p>
</o:p></p>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal">It is possible to install storage routers, so you could route between ethernet and infiniband.<o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal">It is also worth saying that Mellanox have Metro Infiniband switches - though I do not think they go as far as the west of London!<o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><o:p> </o:p></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal">Seriously though , you ask about RoCE. I will stick my neck out and say yes, if you are planning an Openstack cluster<o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal">with the intention of having mixed AI and 'traditional' HPC workloads I would go for a RoCE style setup.<o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal">In fact I am on a discussion about a new project for a customer with similar aims in an hours time.<o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><o:p> </o:p></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal">I could get some benchmarking time if you want to do a direct comparison of Gromacs on IB / RoCE<o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><o:p> </o:p></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><o:p> </o:p></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><o:p> </o:p></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><o:p> </o:p></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><o:p> </o:p></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><o:p> </o:p></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><o:p> </o:p></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><o:p> </o:p></p>
</div>
</div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><o:p> </o:p></p>
<div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal">On Thu, 26 Nov 2020 at 11:14, Jörg Saßmannshausen <<a href="mailto:sassy-work@sassy.formativ.net">sassy-work@sassy.formativ.net</a>> wrote:<o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
<blockquote style="border:none;border-left:solid #CCCCCC 1.0pt;padding:0in 0in 0in 6.0pt;margin-left:4.8pt;margin-right:0in">
<p class="MsoNormal">Dear all,<br>
<br>
as the DNS problems have been solve (many thanks for doing this!), I was <br>
wondering if people on the list have some experiences with this question:<br>
<br>
We are currently in the process to purchase a new cluster and we want to use <br>
OpenStack for the whole management of the cluster. Part of the cluster will <br>
run HPC applications like GROMACS for example, other parts typical OpenStack <br>
applications like VM. We also are implementing a Data Safe Haven for the more <br>
sensitive data we are aiming to process. Of course, we want to have a decent <br>
size GPU partition as well!<br>
<br>
Now, traditionally I would say that we are going for InfiniBand. However, for <br>
reasons I don't want to go into right now, our existing file storage (Lustre) <br>
will be in a different location. Thus, we decided to go for RoCE for the file <br>
storage and InfiniBand for the HPC applications. <br>
<br>
The point I am struggling is to understand if this is really the best of the <br>
solution or given that we are not building a 100k node cluster, we could use <br>
RoCE for the few nodes which are doing parallel, read MPI, jobs too. <br>
I have a nagging feeling that I am missing something if we are moving to pure <br>
RoCE and ditch the InfiniBand. We got a mixed workload, from ML/AI to MPI <br>
applications like GROMACS to pipelines like they are used in the bioinformatic <br>
corner. We are not planning to partition the GPUs, the current design model is <br>
to have only 2 GPUs in a chassis. <br>
So, is there something I am missing or is the stomach feeling I have really a <br>
lust for some sushi? :-)<br>
<br>
Thanks for your sentiments here, much welcome!<br>
<br>
All the best from a dull London<br>
<br>
Jörg<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
_______________________________________________<br>
Beowulf mailing list, <a href="mailto:Beowulf@beowulf.org" target="_blank">Beowulf@beowulf.org</a> sponsored by Penguin Computing<br>
To change your subscription (digest mode or unsubscribe) visit <a href="https://nam11.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=https%3A%2F%2Fbeowulf.org%2Fcgi-bin%2Fmailman%2Flistinfo%2Fbeowulf&data=04%7C01%7CShainer%40nvidia.com%7C8e220b6be2fa48921dce08d892005b27%7C43083d15727340c1b7db39efd9ccc17a%7C0%7C0%7C637419877513157960%7CUnknown%7CTWFpbGZsb3d8eyJWIjoiMC4wLjAwMDAiLCJQIjoiV2luMzIiLCJBTiI6Ik1haWwiLCJXVCI6Mn0%3D%7C1000&sdata=0NLRDQHkYol82mmqs%2BQrFryEuitIpDss2NwgIeyg1K8%3D&reserved=0" target="_blank">
https://beowulf.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/beowulf</a><o:p></o:p></p>
</blockquote>
</div>
</div>
</div>
</body>
</html>