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<TITLE>RE: [Beowulf] posting bonnie++ stats from our cluster: any comments about my I/O performance stats?</TITLE>
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<P><FONT SIZE=2>Rahul,<BR>
<BR>
>From what you posted to the list there is no need to apologize. If there was something going on behind<BR>
the curtains personally between you and Jeff then that is not really a concern to the list.<BR>
<BR>
Keep asking questions and keep curious, and keep posting back results that you find. In fact I find it very<BR>
interesting, especially since technology progresses so fast, and estimates based on experience expire rather quickly.<BR>
<BR>
Maybe I should mention some pieces of advice on how to deal with vendors that I base on<BR>
my experience of being on the other side of the fence as a sales engineer for many years:<BR>
<BR>
Engage multiple vendors and let them propose technical solutions to your use cases / performance / application goals.<BR>
Some will have quite technically skilled sales engineering resources, and Jeff Layton for sure is somebody with deep<BR>
technical experience. Treat public whitepapers as marketing material that will show the solution in the<BR>
best light for the best use case and not as a hard technical information. They are still interesting to skim over<BR>
as they describe specific solutions and their intended properties.<BR>
<BR>
Then engage in a personal technical dialog with vendors software engineers and try to get to a more technically<BR>
sound solution plus estimate of what it can really do, what its potential drawbacks and advantages are.<BR>
<BR>
I know vendors don't like this (I work for one) but it is in your best interest to talk through<BR>
the alternative designs you got from other vendors with the sales engineer and have him shoot it down to the best<BR>
of his ability. Keep in mind he is trying to sell you his solution, so he won't necessarily highlight the good in the alternative<BR>
design, but he will highlight the weaknesses that the other designer did not choose to focus on. Bring up those points<BR>
with the alternative designer to see if they can rebut it quickly, and also do your own research about it.<BR>
<BR>
Then consolidate the designs and base your choice of vendor not just on the cheapest price of components but on how qualified<BR>
the design was, because a lot of value is in getting the right solution and ongoing support, not just the right parts. Let all vendors<BR>
know why you choose design / vendor X so they can adjust their offerings in the future to fit your needs.<BR>
<BR>
Best of luck - Michael Will, HPC Software Engineer at Penguin Computing<BR>
<BR>
-----Original Message-----<BR>
From: beowulf-bounces@beowulf.org on behalf of Rahul Nabar<BR>
Sent: Fri 9/25/2009 9:12 AM<BR>
To: Jeff Layton<BR>
Cc: Beowulf Mailing List<BR>
Subject: Re: [Beowulf] posting bonnie++ stats from our cluster: any comments about my I/O performance stats?<BR>
<BR>
On Fri, Sep 25, 2009 at 8:52 AM, Jeff Layton <laytonjb@att.net> wrote:<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
>I don't want to take a public list to pick a fight but I don't want Rahul to<BR>
>bad mouth me, my reputation, and the company I work for without some<BR>
>sort or rebuttal.<BR>
<BR>
Jeff:<BR>
<BR>
I'm sorry that you take this as bad mouthing you. I sincerely<BR>
apologize as this wasn't the intention at all. I am speaking with<BR>
several vendors and my comments weren't directed at you. It is true<BR>
though that we have been a major purchaser of Dell systems. Sometimes<BR>
we are happy and sometimes we are not . And this goes to all vendors.<BR>
<BR>
Now there is one thing (in hindsight) that I think *I am* guilty of:<BR>
I've been posting a lot of questions on the list. Many of you guys are<BR>
very well paid professionals and I ought not to be abusing your time<BR>
for free. I apologize if I have.<BR>
<BR>
On the other hand let me make my position clearer: Buying a good<BR>
system for my institution is a goal, sure. But a lot of this<BR>
benchmarking that I do here is from a purely scientific curiosity I<BR>
have in understanding what I am buying or working with. Building,<BR>
selling, or maintaining Beowulf systems is *not* my primary<BR>
occupation. But all through my graduate student stint I've worked on<BR>
these and I cannot help that I have a curiosity for this stuff.<BR>
<BR>
Clusters, linux and Beowulf and all the related stuff is fascinating.<BR>
I just want to know more about the systems I am using. I am willing to<BR>
do my homework but sometimes post to get opinions from other experts<BR>
that know better. Of course, I do realize that this is free advice<BR>
from peers and I have no expectation of more.<BR>
<BR>
Again, I apologize if I hurt any feelings. That wasn't my intention at all.<BR>
<BR>
--<BR>
Rahul<BR>
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